NJPW G1 Climax 25 (Discussion)

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DylanZero
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Re: Full 2015 G1 Schedule

Post by DylanZero » Wed Jul 08, 2015 8:16 am

Goto vs Ishii, Ishii vs Honma, & my beloved Goto vs. Honma are what I'm looking forward to the most. Plus any matches those 3 are involved in.

I don't think it's impossible Honma goes on a bit of a run, but not enough to be a true contender. My scenario for this would be him losing all of his first matches in a row and getting his "big" win on August 9 vs. Nakamura and it get played up as the big deal it is and Korakuen goes nuts...Then the next B Block night he upsets Ishii in the main event. The crowd goes even more nuts. Then he finishes off with an upset on Yujiro and is talked about as the hottest guy on the roster. This accomplishes him getting his big special win over a main eventer instead of having it wasted on Yujiro or Elgin or some loser like that, it elevates him and starts his journey to see if he can be something more than a lovable loser (which I fully believe the crowd will continue to make that evident) and isn't too much where he has a chance to win the Block or something. I think he's one of the guys with huge untapped potential in the short term (next 3 years or so) that needs to at least be explored regardless of whether you believe in him or not as more and this year could be a bit of a test run for a real run next year.
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Joe Lanza
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Re: Full 2015 G1 Schedule

Post by Joe Lanza » Wed Jul 08, 2015 1:19 pm

The only difference between this year and last from that perspective is that Honma has been winning a little bit in tags, usually over Yujiro. But I agree, go big or don't bother. I'm not interested in a token win on the last day to go 1-8.

Even though it was a tag win, beating Shelton last year would have watered down the Dome win.

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Joe Lanza
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Re: Full 2015 G1 Schedule

Post by Joe Lanza » Wed Jul 08, 2015 1:20 pm

I wasnt responding to DylanZero I forgot to quote someone from earlier in the thread.

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Rich Kraetsch
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Re: Full 2015 G1 Schedule

Post by Rich Kraetsch » Wed Jul 08, 2015 1:38 pm

ceftaxias wrote:
Rich Kraetsch wrote:
Joe Lanza wrote:Honma should either lose all of his matches again, or end up making a run and being a contender.

My fear is they build him to one big win.

I think he may end up being a middle of the pack guy, since he scored a big fall at the Dome, and has scored falls in other tag matches this year as well. I don't like that either. Ether lose every match or break his heart on the last day. Preferably the latter.
Rob and I broke this down on the mini-Dominion review/videocast deal we recorded last night. The only way Honma picks up a win in G1 is either randomly beating Elgin or winning his last match against Yujiro. A prolonged run of wins doesn't make sense given his opponents and the block he's in.
The idea of Honma beating Yujiro on the last night is being thrown around a lot, but I see that as no different from his match against Shelton last year, both pointless for him to win. If one year it does happen I think it should be monumental thing, against a top guy maybe on the last day spoiling him from making the final.

The fact that he's pinned Yujiro multiple times this year makes me think Yujiro might win that one, even though he's so low at this point people probably expect Honma to beat him.
I've always said I don't care exactly HOW he wins that first big singles match but that when he does win, it can't just be thrown away. It needs to begin a prolonged period of victories and a mini-run. That's why I've always said I would save that big win and make it for the NEVER title or something. That seems like a cool way for him to have a monumental win and then allow him to keep winning for a little bit and have some meaning there.

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kjharris
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Re: Full 2015 G1 Schedule

Post by kjharris » Wed Jul 08, 2015 1:47 pm

Joe Lanza wrote:Even though it was a tag win, beating Shelton last year would have watered down the Dome win.
What a moment in the annals of wrestling history that was.

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K. Hare
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Re: Full 2015 G1 Schedule

Post by K. Hare » Wed Jul 08, 2015 2:01 pm

Still wish he won the Shibata match. Probably would have been my MOTY if he did

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Joe Lanza
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Re: Full 2015 G1 Schedule

Post by Joe Lanza » Wed Jul 08, 2015 2:38 pm

kjharris wrote:
Joe Lanza wrote:Even though it was a tag win, beating Shelton last year would have watered down the Dome win.
What a moment in the annals of wrestling history that was.
Heh.

It did get an enormous pop, and it was on the biggest show of the year. Would not have been my choice (something over a star in Korakuen would be what I would have done), but to me it was much better than beating Benjamin in a nothing match.

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Joe Lanza
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Re: Full 2015 G1 Schedule

Post by Joe Lanza » Wed Jul 08, 2015 2:40 pm

The one advantage to the Dome tag fall is that they still have the singles win in their back pocket.

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Drew Wardlaw
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Re: Full 2015 G1 Schedule

Post by Drew Wardlaw » Wed Jul 08, 2015 3:14 pm

I really don't want to see Honma win, like ever. It's not often when every singles match the guy has is must watch, knowing full well the guy is going to lose. I buy in every match and it's awesome. I want to chase that dragon forever.

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Chismo
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Re: Full 2015 G1 Schedule

Post by Chismo » Wed Jul 08, 2015 4:04 pm

Honma will beat Ishii in a Korakuen main event, and it's going to be the best moment of the year. That is, of course, right after Tenzan's Anaconda Vice victory over Shibata.

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kjharris
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Re: Full 2015 G1 Schedule

Post by kjharris » Wed Jul 08, 2015 5:18 pm

Joe Lanza wrote:
kjharris wrote:
Joe Lanza wrote:Even though it was a tag win, beating Shelton last year would have watered down the Dome win.
What a moment in the annals of wrestling history that was.
Heh.

It did get an enormous pop, and it was on the biggest show of the year. Would not have been my choice (something over a star in Korakuen would be what I would have done), but to me it was much better than beating Benjamin in a nothing match.
I agree with your point that Honma beating Benjamin last year would have come too late to mean much of anything (especially as Shelton wasn't in the running to win his group). But it's not like New Japan made the most of it when they eventually gave Honma his "big" win either (and I'd imagine Honma picking up a victory at the Dome would have still gotten a pretty huge pop, even if he had been given a token win in last year's G1). He pinned Yujiro after Jeff Jarrett hit his own partner with his guitar in a five minute undercard match that had no promotional build. Your comment just came across to me to be defending mediocre booking in a way few would do for WWE in similar circumstances.

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Statoke
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Re: Full 2015 G1 Schedule

Post by Statoke » Wed Jul 08, 2015 6:18 pm

If Honma is going to beat Yujiro then he should beat Ishii prior to make it look like he caught fire at the end of the G1 and go on to get a sort of push.
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Shining Wiz
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Re: Full 2015 G1 Schedule

Post by Shining Wiz » Wed Jul 08, 2015 7:05 pm

Drew Wardlaw wrote:I really don't want to see Honma win, like ever. It's not often when every singles match the guy has is must watch, knowing full well the guy is going to lose. I buy in every match and it's awesome. I want to chase that dragon forever.

Eventually he's going to win. He might even get a little run after said win. But Honma loses a lot of why he's over as soon as he wins.

This is not, like Dylan Hales said on the PWO Dominion reaction show, like WWE not knowing what to do with Cesaro. This is NJPW knowing exactly why the crowd is so into Honma and not wanting to ruin that too soon. The crowds are into him because he's the underdog who just keeps trying (no matter how many times he's failed) and just keeps HOPING that he gets that singles win (because, let's be honest, the tag wins are just to keep the hope alive). Once he gets the big win, the shine is off. I'm not saying the crowd gives up on him after the win, but it definitely won't be as in to him after he wins.

Plus, he's 40. He MIGHT get a NEVER title run as a "Thanks for the hard work" gift, but he's never sniffing the IWGP or Intercontinental titles.

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Joe Lanza
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Re: Full 2015 G1 Schedule

Post by Joe Lanza » Wed Jul 08, 2015 10:29 pm

Shining Wiz wrote:
Drew Wardlaw wrote:I really don't want to see Honma win, like ever. It's not often when every singles match the guy has is must watch, knowing full well the guy is going to lose. I buy in every match and it's awesome. I want to chase that dragon forever.

Eventually he's going to win. He might even get a little run after said win. But Honma loses a lot of why he's over as soon as he wins.

This is not, like Dylan Hales said on the PWO Dominion reaction show, like WWE not knowing what to do with Cesaro. This is NJPW knowing exactly why the crowd is so into Honma and not wanting to ruin that too soon. The crowds are into him because he's the underdog who just keeps trying (no matter how many times he's failed) and just keeps HOPING that he gets that singles win (because, let's be honest, the tag wins are just to keep the hope alive). Once he gets the big win, the shine is off. I'm not saying the crowd gives up on him after the win, but it definitely won't be as in to him after he wins.

Plus, he's 40. He MIGHT get a NEVER title run as a "Thanks for the hard work" gift, but he's never sniffing the IWGP or Intercontinental titles.
Bingo. All of this.

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Goat
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Re: Full 2015 G1 Schedule

Post by Goat » Wed Jul 08, 2015 11:32 pm

Rewatching the announcement Tanahashi vs Tenzan got a really nice pop

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